[Hidden-tech] Goodmail spells doom for mailing lists?

[Victor Danilchenko]

all at pinehurstpictures.com wrote:
>    ** Be a Good Dobee and help the group, you must be counted to post .
>    ** Fill out the survey/skills inventory in the member's area.
> 
> 
> Taxing is not a solution. How much do you want to pay? $0.50 $1.00?  I use email for both business and personal communication. If it were 
taxed I'd cut down my time on the net. I'm sure others would too. And we 
HAVE to keep the government OUT of the net. They could kill it.

	First of all, the price we are talking about would be on the order of a 
thousandth of a cent. This way, regular users wouldn't even notice -- 
but spammers, who send out millions of messages at a time, couldn't 
afford it. This point was already mentioned in prior discussion.

	Secondly, the government has nothing to do with it. It would be 
entirely up to each mail service provider to decide whether to accept or 
reject non-paid mail.  Of course realistically, if such a system becomes 
widespread, then the non-paid mail would come predominantly from spammers.

	Thirdly, the price doesn't have to actually be in money. There is a 
similar scheme in existence where the 'payment' would be made in CPU 
time -- i.e. to sign each mail, the sending computer would have to 
perform a calculation that would take, say, 1/2 second to complete, but 
would be trivial to verify for the receiving system. Again, trivial for 
regular users, prohibitively expensive for spammers.

	Lastly, the GOVERNMENT had both created the Internet initially (the 
ARPANET project), and then made it commercially viable by allowing 
private entities to use the hitherto-government-only network of 
universities, non-educational research institutions, and defense 
installation. Incidentally, senator Albert Gore was instrumental in 
getting the US government to open up the Internet to commercial 
interests, in effect transforming it from a closed government network to 
the globe-spanning juggernaut we all know and love.

> Rikk
> Pinehurst Pictures & Sound
> www.pinehurstpictures.com
> 
>>From: "Andy Klapper" <andytk at charter.net>
>>Date: 2006/02/17 Fri PM 05:19:21 EST
>>To: <hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net>
>>Subject: RE: [Hidden-tech] Goodmail spells doom for mailing lists?
>>
>>   ** Be a Good Dobee and help the group, you must be counted to post .
>>   ** Fill out the survey/skills inventory in the member's area.
>>
>>
>>
>>I've always thought that the only real solution to spam was to put a small
>>price on each email.  Small enough that your internet provider would absorb
>>the cost for a reasonable number of emails per month, large enough that
>>100,000 to one response rates are no longer economical for the people that
>>pay the spammers to spam.  Spammers don't spam for ha ha's, they do it
>>because it costs very little to spam tens of millions of people, and if you
>>can get 100 of them to buy your fake Viagra you've made a profit.  This
>>doesn't mean that spam would go away, just be reduced to more targeted
>>marking, just like what happens with snail mail.
>>
>>Of course email within a system, say a company's own email server, would not
>>get taxed.
>>
>>The downside of course is that any organization that depends on free email
>>would be hurt.  They could however switch to forums / bulletin boards.
>>
>>I'm talking about taxing every email that enters the net.  Not the Goodmail
>>system where you pay for the equivalent of certified mail.
>>
>>
>>
>>Andy.
>>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: hidden-discuss-bounces at lists.hidden-tech.net
>>[mailto:hidden-discuss-bounces at lists.hidden-tech.net]On Behalf Of Rikk
>>Desgres
>>Sent: Friday, February 17, 2006 4:50 PM
>>To: Jonathan Dill; hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net
>>Subject: Re: [Hidden-tech] Goodmail spells doom for mailing lists?
>>
>>
>>   ** Be a Good Dobee and help the group, you must be counted to post .
>>   ** Fill out the survey/skills inventory in the member's area.
>>
>>
>>All email will still get through, only the Goodmail will have a stamp or an
>>icon next to it. Spammers will just pay the $0.025 for each email. They will
>>figure it's still cheaper than USPS. I don't think it will help. As much as
>>I hate spam, I'm NOT buying stock in Goodmail.
>>
>>Rikk
>>
>>
>>
>>on 2/17/06 1:22 PM, Jonathan Dill at jfdill at jfdill.com wrote:
>>
>>
>>> ** Be a Good Dobee and help the group, you must be counted to post .
>>> ** Fill out the survey/skills inventory in the member's area.
>>>
>>>
>>>Has everyone heard about the changes planned by AOL, Yahoo! etc. to
>>>require "certification" via Goodmail or just be blocked?  There will be
>>>a fraction of a cent fee to send "bulk" e-mail messages.
>>>
>>>http://www.clickz.com/news/article.php/3581301
>>>
>>>http://www.goodmailsystems.com/
>>>
>>>What will happen to a mailing list such as this one?  Will AOL and
>>>Yahoo! users just be out of luck or have to get an e-mail account with
>>>another provider in order to receive mailing lists?  Maybe this mailing
>>>list is small enough that the fees could be manageable, but I manage one
>>>mailing list for a small business that has about 45,000 subscribers.  On
>>>the surface, I guess the certification sounded like a good idea, but for
>>>a lot of organizations, like this one or any of numerous all-volunteer
>>>developer projects, it is going to put an unfair tax on e-mail.
>>>
>>>Jonathan
>>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>Hidden-discuss mailing list - home page: http://www.hidden-tech.net
>>>Hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net
>>>
>>>You are receiving this because you are on the Hidden-Tech Discussion list.
>>>If you would like to change your list preferences, Go to the Members
>>>page on the Hidden Tech Web site.
>>>http://www.hidden-tech.net/members
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Hidden-discuss mailing list - home page: http://www.hidden-tech.net
>>Hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net
>>
>>You are receiving this because you are on the Hidden-Tech Discussion list.
>>If you would like to change your list preferences, Go to the Members
>>page on the Hidden Tech Web site.
>>http://www.hidden-tech.net/members
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Hidden-discuss mailing list - home page: http://www.hidden-tech.net
>>Hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net
>>
>>You are receiving this because you are on the Hidden-Tech Discussion list.
>>If you would like to change your list preferences, Go to the Members   
>>page on the Hidden Tech Web site.
>>http://www.hidden-tech.net/members
>>
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Hidden-discuss mailing list - home page: http://www.hidden-tech.net
> Hidden-discuss at lists.hidden-tech.net
> 
> You are receiving this because you are on the Hidden-Tech Discussion list.
> If you would like to change your list preferences, Go to the Members   
> page on the Hidden Tech Web site.
> http://www.hidden-tech.net/members