I'm keeping a close eye on ROR. I don't currently use or even dabble in it (though I have in the past) and like any newer development tool, it needs time to mature. It can be very quick for lite web applications. I'd like to hear how it works for larger projects if anyone knows. PHP & Mysql are still my bread and butter, but I welcome anything that can reduce the mundane task load, so I am watching eagerly to see what transpires. Fred