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<font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif">Hi Rob,<br>
<br>
I definitely agree with all your points, we won't know if there's
an acceptable solution for quite some time in any case. The only
real reason to flatten the curve is to prevent overload of medical
resources and shortages of PPE (personal protective equipment) due
to sheer numbers of people getting sick at a time, in order to
have the time to ramp up production and distribution, and
acquiring knowledge and skills that reduce mortality rates and
long term damage to the lungs such as which drugs reduce symptoms
and help the lungs and simple things like lying on your stomach.
At some point, either most people will need to have gotten it
(herd immunity) or we'll need a vaccine. <br>
<br>
There are a number of things we can do to improve immune response
both to keep from getting sick and to improve odds and rate of
recovery. Here's some I know. There are lots of different opinions
and conflicting research so this is just my take:<br>
<br>
Lomatium dissectum (an herb in the parsley/carrot family) was used
very successfully by Native Americans and people who took their
lead, to keep from getting sick and reduce the symptoms during the
Spanish Flu. Very good antiviral/antibacterial that is especially
good for lung infections and tends to be very well tolerated, a
few people get a rash from it which might actually be a die-off
reaction.<br>
</font><font face="Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif"><a
href="http://chasblogspot.blogspot.com/2009/04/spanish-flu-of-1918-and-lomatium-root.html">http://chasblogspot.blogspot.com/2009/04/spanish-flu-of-1918-and-lomatium-root.html</a><br>
Lomatium alcohol tincture is quite bitter, the glycerine tincture
is much milder. It's very hard to find in stock right now but
hopefully there will be more available soon.<br>
<br>
Generally, supplementing vitamins and minerals you're deficient in
can be helpful but overuse is not -- more is not better once you
have what you need. And the best way to get your supplements is
from food. Most of what you take in a multivitamin goes down the
toilet, which is why it's almost impossible to get the levels of
vitamins and minerals that people recommend from food. Studies
have shown that organic foods have significantly higher levels of
vitamins and minerals, however levels vary a lot depending on how
the food is actually grown. High quality locally grown non-organic
foods can compare well with organic and may actually have been
grown pretty much organically, with minimal pesticides and healthy
soil.<br>
<br>
Vitamin D (2000 IU/day) is particularly helpful with lung
infections, and most people have a deficiency especially when we
aren't out in the sun:<br>
</font>
<div class="moz-signature"><a
href="https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/vitamin-d-coronavirus#effect-on-immune-health">https://www.healthline.com/nutrition/vitamin-d-coronavirus#effect-on-immune-health</a><br>
<blockquote type="cite">
<p style="-webkit-font-smoothing: antialiased; box-sizing:
inherit; margin-bottom: 25px; margin-top: 25px; font-size:
18px; line-height: 26px; color: rgb(35, 31, 32); font-family:
"Proxima Nova", system-ui, sans-serif; font-style:
normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">A recent review that
included 11,321 people from 14 countries demonstrated that
supplementing with vitamin D decreased the risk of acute
respiratory infections (ARI) in both those who were deficient
in vitamin D and those with adequate levels.</p>
<p style="-webkit-font-smoothing: antialiased; box-sizing:
inherit; margin-bottom: 25px; margin-top: 25px; font-size:
18px; line-height: 26px; color: rgb(35, 31, 32); font-family:
"Proxima Nova", system-ui, sans-serif; font-style:
normal; font-variant-ligatures: normal; font-variant-caps:
normal; font-weight: 400; letter-spacing: normal; orphans: 2;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none;
white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; text-decoration-style:
initial; text-decoration-color: initial;">Overall, the study
showed that vitamin D supplements reduced the risk of
developing at least one ARI by 12%. The protective effect was
strongest in those with low vitamin D levels</p>
</blockquote>
Zinc (30mg/day) and Vitamin C (1-2000 mg/day with supplements,
natural sources less) are two nutritionals that are both
antioxidants and also help boost the immune system. Foods rich in
zinc are meat, shellfish, legumes, nuts and seeds, dairy, eggs and
whole grains. Foods rich in vitamin C include broccoli,
cantaloupe, cauliflower, kale, kiwi, orange juice, papaya, red,
green or yellow pepper, sweet potato, strawberries, and tomatoes.<br>
Probiotics (lactobacillus and bifidobacterium are the most common)
help with gut health and are naturally antibiotic and antiviral.<br>
<br>
There's many more but I think these are a good place to start.<br>
<br>
Best,<br>
Sam<br>
<br>
<hr size="1">
Sam McClellan<br>
<strong>Itabix, Inc</strong><br>
<i>One place for all things Web</i><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:sam@itabix.com">sam@itabix.com</a><br>
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://itabix.com">https://itabix.com</a><br>
Main - 413.587.4600<br>
Toll-free - 877-7ITABIX (877.748.2249) <br>
<br>
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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 4/15/2020 9:01 AM, Rob Laporte via
Hidden-discuss wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:MN2PR14MB2509606AC1BDAB51F4926490E5DB0@MN2PR14MB2509.namprd14.prod.outlook.com">
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11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<div>Hi HTers,<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>I worry that, for a variety of reasons, ever more Americans
can’t perform simple reasoning. But maybe what’s seems so
clear to me is some kind of delusion. Sp I ask whether the
following reasoning is sound.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>
<ol>
<li>Flattening the curve increases the time span until herd
immunity but not the percentage of the population needed
for herd immunity.</li>
<ol style="list-style: lower-alpha;">
<li>The math on what's needed for herd immunity is quite
simple as math goes, depending on transmissibility, and
standing now at about 80%. Whatever this percentage is
does not change the login here.</li>
</ol>
<li>Social distancing, masks, hand-washing, and the like
flatten the curve but won’t reduce the total area under
the curve and above the horizontal axis of time. That is,
sooner or later, the same quantity of people will
ultimately contract Covid-19.</li>
<li>Even if 10% of the population has it now (and countries
doing good testing show nothing close to that yet),
pre-pandemic behavior would produce a flare up of
occurrences nearly equal to past flare ups. Of course the
higher the percentage of the population that becomes
immune, the slower it spreads, but even at 25%, it would
spread fast. (A simple math matter for anyone qualified). </li>
<li>If, as more research is showing but not yet concluding,
people aren't immune after recovery, this cycle never
ends--and vaccines would not produce immunity either. </li>
<ol style="list-style: lower-alpha;">
<li>The math of x percent of recovered are immune for Y
months is also relatively simple math that enables
planning. </li>
<ol style="list-style: lower-roman;">
<li>Average duration of immunity after a recovery from a
coronaviruses is 48 months, according to one summary
all past studies.</li>
</ol>
</ol>
<li>Therefore, <span style="font-family: Verdana, Geneva,
sans-serif; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);
display: inline !important">
if a vaccine can't be made, </span>return to the way
things were before he pandemic is not
<span style="font-family: Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline
!important">
remotely possible ever.</span></li>
<li><span style="font-family: Verdana, Geneva, sans-serif;
background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255); display: inline
!important">If a successful, permanently effective
vaccine can be made, only after almost everyone has take
it can things begin to return to the way they were
before the pandemic. </span></li>
</ol>
<div>Seems like solid reasoning to me. If it is, we'd best be
planning for it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div>This is more speculative, but stands to reason: Regarding
treatment and outcomes, increasingly strong evidence shows
that much of the damage is done by +2 and +3 charged iron free
radicals released when the virus replaces iron in blood cells.
Leave aside for the moment the problem of blood carrying less
oxygen. Strong free radical scavengers would likely improve
outcomes, perhaps substantially, because tissue damage,
usually mostly to the lungs, is a big contributor to grave
illness and death. Such has has been shown with vitamin C's
positive effects, but there are stronger antioxidants
available over the counter. This would mean that we don't need
big pharma as much for treatment, and that inexpensive and
widely available supplements would substantially reduce
hospitalization rates. Since mainstream media gets a huge
percent of its revenue from big pharma, such news may be slow
to spread. </div>
</div>
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