Hi Robert, I think we need to return to main point. Regardless of gripes about the manufactures of computer operating systems being co-opted and the physical source of the email spam is illegal and sending it is now a criminal activity punishable by jail time. It is an expense to each one of us and a block to creative endeavors. Spammers are literally criminals and they can be found because the money from the web sites that sell their products or scams has to go someplace. Many are truly here in the US even here in our state. Even if the sources of the spammer's sites are overseas we do have embassies and ambassadors. Some foreign countries are also fighting spammers. I am not saying that we can solve the entire problem but let us engage the problem head on rather than hiding behind the latest real time black lists or Antispam service that slows down our computers. We as citizens have the right to pressure our government at both state and federal level to enforce the laws take more action. We can pressure politicians. We can show the police them how to track these people down if they do not know already. Even now there are significant tools available to track these criminals down. I have had a few people indicate they are interest in such a meeting. I would like a sense if you can not attend you allow myself or the other hidden tech people to communicate to law enforcement on your behalf. Please let me know directly or though this forum so I can use the support as a lever to force a meeting? Roman Roman Victor, Software Developer RVPM Designs 8 Coach Ln Amherst, MA 01002 413 253-6547 413 695-9425 cell romanvictor at rvpmdesigns.com www.rvpmdesigns.com